Just because he may be a little racist, doesn’t mean that Islamic fundamentalists aren’t a threat, right?

Guest Post by David Kelsey.

Note: While I don’t necessarily agree with David’s ideas, he is a buddy and I do feel his concerns merit discussion. Jewlicious is, after all, all about the conversation! -ck

Geert Wilders. Source: AFP

Geert Wilders. Source: AFP

Holland, and of course, its signature city, Amsterdam, is well known as a place of tolerance. Many of us look to Amsterdam as the epitome of libertarian-socialism.

But the Dutch have their problems. And although the Dutch are themselves a tolerant people, they have a history of weakness when confronted by outsiders who seek to install tyranny. The Dutch did not resist the Nazis with the same fervor as segments of other European countries. Once again, the Dutch are demonstrating weakness against an enemy of western liberalism, and the Dutch are surrendering yet more territory and freedom to Islamicism.

Geert Wilders is to be prosecuted for insulting Islam. He is a resistor to the Islamicists’ dark vision of expansive Shariah Law, and at the center of this travesty of justice is a film Wilders produced warning of the true nature of the Islamicists’ vision, called “Fitna.”

The significance of his criminal prosecution is dire. As Rod Dreher wrote,

“The Dutch court’s action goes a long way toward vindicating Wilders’ claim that the Dutch are losing their freedoms and their democracy because of the Muslim presence among them.”

I would note that wherever there is a significant Muslim population in the West, there are significant problems. Jews must stop obstructing those who want to reform our outdated immigration policies. Social-liberals will and do pretend that I am claiming all or most Muslims are a threat. But I am not. It is never all, and it certainly need not be most. But the problems subsist, despite insistence from the Left that it is impolite and unfair to generalize. About non-white people, that is.

Many Liberal Jews will do mental gymnastics do prove that the Torah’s demand that we love the stranger or because we were strangers in Egypt somehow incontrovertibly translates into blanket endorsement of continued mass immigration policies. Mass immigration of “others” to America, by the way, not to Israel, of course, because they’re not that crazy apparently, unbeknownst to our sages, in this specific instance, the Torah endorsed mass immigration of gentiles to non-Jewish countries only, in striking contrast to all other land-oriented mitzvahs which are only applicable to the Land of Israel.

However, these same Jews, who are so passionate about the Torah’s “endorsement” of mass immigration (to the U.S.) concurrently ignore a blatant and specific warning from Sarah that Yishmael will “play” with Yitzchok while a birthright is being contested if they are found inside the same house.

I wonder why Sarah’s warning is never considered in any fashion by these Liberal Jews. I guess they figure Sarah Imeinu was just an incorrigible racist crypto-fascist bitch. Surely, everything could be going just dandy, if only. If only there wasn’t…”institutionalized racism!” For all domestic problems in each and every western country where Islam has a significant base are surely due to in large part to institutionalized racism. It’s institutionalized racism’s fault! Institutionalized racism is the problem! And from that perspective, the situation can be solved quite easily…by capitulating more and more to the Islamicists’ demands. And as they raise the bar for “sensitivity,” simply appease them still more.

As for Wilders himself, well, to say he is a friend of the Jewish people is a gross understatement. Some of you Zionist folks may find it relevant to know that Wilders apparently had a very positive experience working on a Moshav back in the day, and he adores Israel, declaring,

“The past years I have visited many interesting countries, from Tunisia to Turkey and from Cyprus to Iran, but nowhere I have that special feeling of solidarity that I always get if I set foot on the Israeli Ben Gurion Airport.”

Thus far, mainstream Jewish organizations such as the AJC have been silent on Wilders prosecution.

Geert Wilders has lived in fear for years. It is unique men and women like Wilders and the grand convert to the West, Hirsi Ali, who both understand the threat we are all facing from Islamcist immigrants, and are willing to put their own lives and well-being at risk by speaking out against them. Both require constant security protection. Theo Van Gogh, of course, was already killed for insulting the Religion of Peace.

But this newest victory against freedom to protest the Islamicization of Holland and Europe was simply handed to the Islamicists through Dutch capitulation to creeping Shariah.

Please support Wilders, and sign this petition of protest of his treatment. And please rethink the likely effects of our current immigration policies. Just to be clear, that means not merely regurgitating inaccurate and incomplete platitudes about how, “We are a nation of immigrants.” It means seriously considering the implications and the eventual outcome of our current (post-1965) policies in today’s world. It means studying the problems afflicting Amsterdam, Paris, and London, and plenty of other western cities and countries, and honestly evaluating if this is the route we want to take here in the U.S.

Domestically, it isn’t contingent only on essays, media bias, or even lobbies. It’s fundamentally all about the numbers. That is why Chicago suffered the most domestic problems during the latest conflict. Chicago is the center of the Palestinian and Jordanian communities in the U.S. We point to the bias of Europe and blame anti-semitism, but ignore the underlying reality of how vastly outnumbered the Jews are by Muslims in these nations. Read Truman’s statement defending his pro-Zionist policies carefully. Consider the implications.

“I am sorry, gentlemen, but I have to answer to hundreds of thousands who are anxious for the success of Zionism: I do not have hundreds of thousands of Arabs among my constituents.”

To do right by Wilders and Hirsi Ali, we have to do more than merely protect their right to free speech. We should listen and consider what they have to say, and evaluate it honestly, without sentimentalism.

Alternatively, we can risk our own demise, both our domestic position, and Israel’s favored status in the U.S., by welcoming millions of Muslim immigrants with strong and vastly different and conflicting P.O.V.s than our own. But why?

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About the author

ck

Founder and Publisher of Jewlicious, David Abitbol lives in Jerusalem with his wife, newborn daughter and toddler son. Blogging as "ck" he's been blocked on twitter by the right and the left, so he's doing something right.

72 Comments

  • Can you please explain the context of Sarah worrying about Yishmail “playing” with Yitzhak? Perhaps even a quotation.

  • Never thought I’d agree with Kelsey on anything, but, hey.

    Wilders needs a new hair stylist, though.

    Wilders himself may very well be a friend of Israel and the Jews, but a lot of the people in the forefront of the fight against the Islamazoids in Europe are European nativists with strong Nazi, fascist, and racist tendencies. However, they seem to be the only people who have the sense to see the danger that the Islam poses to the West.

    People who call themselves liberal yet refuse to confront Islamo fascism or consider the danger it poses cede the field to crypto-Nazi groups like the Vlamms Belang, and are guaranteeing the eventual outbreak of a monumental race war between the Islamazoids and the native populations of the nations they have infiltrated.

    The Dutch, however, seem to have already decided to become good dhimmis before things get too ugly. They deserve their fate. Cowards.

    Call me when the Dutch prosecute some Islamonazi nutbag for hate crimes for calling Jews apes and pigs.

    What’s that? Not gonna happen?

    Oh well. A man can dream, can’t he?

  • Interesting and provocative, as always, Kelsey.

    Canada has more Muslims than Jews these days, have the Jews or Canadians suffered problems that represent your fears?

    That’s a genuine question.

  • TM: I recall an elementary school library set aflame, an explosive device set off in front of the YMYWHA (JCC) and Jews being manhandled, spat upon, insulted and flags and kippas yanked at a University hosted speech and that’s just in Montreal…

  • While fighting the extremists (on all ends), we should not forget to support the moderates. And we should beware of cheap populism.

  • Actually the Dutch resistance was pretty slick. Maybe not as “ferverous” as Kelsey opines. But the Dutch had a strong and righteous history of hiding children and smuggling Jews to safety (many of whom fled over the Pireneos into Spain).

    Maybe there won’t be a Daniel Craig movie made about them, but it’s just not right to put a machismo scale on resistance. Ya know…

  • Didnt Neo Nazi’s and Muslim march together against Israel in Calgary?

    Must be Calgary, France.

  • Um I find your writing somewhat confusing. You start off with the Dutch issue and the ” Islamicization” of Europe. Then you kind of go off on a rant of how American liberals need to stop with the we’re a nation of immigrants, or we’re going to become just like Europe and suffer from this supposed threat. Last time I checked the largest going ethnic group in the states is Hispanic/Latino: our situation is totally different from Europe’s. Secondly not every muslim is a fanatic who wants push his/her religion on his/her new country. To be honest this reminded me of a conservative talk show host who stated a few years ago that the best way to reduce crime in America would be to abort all black babies. Since you know black people are responsible for all the crime and bad things that happen here.

  • LoBiCh, ironically enough, the former group also is quite fond of Wilders.

    Kelsey, I may not access your site from my server anymore. What unconstitutional stuff have you put up?

  • Lindsey, please read this part of the post.

    Social-liberals will and do pretend that I am claiming all or most Muslims are a threat. But I am not. It is never all, and it certainly need not be most.

    froylein, my site crashed. Should be okay, might lose the last couple weeks that weren’t backed up yet.

  • To quote Cardinal Ratzinger, from a 2004 essay on Islam:

    “The West reveals . . . a hatred of itself, which is strange and can only be considered pathological; the West . . . no longer loves itself; in its own history, it now sees only what is deplorable and destructive, while it is no longer able to perceive what is great and pure.”

    If we in the West and in the US insist on our ideals, and refuse to admit those unable to sign onto them, we’ll be fine– we’ll see the energence of a moderate Islam which can act as an example.

    If we allow creeping sharia law, a la the UK, and permit jihadist agitation, while refraining from any sort of good-faith critique of Islam, we’ll have created an enemy in our midst.

  • You start off with the Dutch issue and the ” Islamicization” of Europe. Then you kind of go off on a rant of how American liberals need to stop with the we’re a nation of immigrants, or we’re going to become just like Europe and suffer from this supposed threat. Last time I checked the largest going ethnic group in the states is Hispanic/Latino: our situation is totally different from Europe’s.

    I don’t think I’ve ever seen Kelsey rant against Hispanics. He’s ranting specifically against mass immigration from Muslim countries, which seems to have caused so many problems in Europe and he thinks is starting to cause a lot of problems here.

    The classic American liberal counterpoint to DK’s fear about mass immigration from Muslim countries is that America is fundamentally different from Europe because America, as a nation of immigrants (i.e., the vast majority of Americans are descended from folks who immigrated in the last few generations), will absorb and assimilate Muslim immigrants (improving relations with the Muslim world), whereas in Europe non-natives supposedly find it harder to integrate into European society, increasing friction and leading to the Islamic radicalization (and corresponding anti-semitism and anti-secularism) that Europe is suffering.

    Kelsey’s counter-counter-argument seems to be that even if the “nation of immigrants” argument works for some immigrant groups (and some might argue that’s a myth altogether), it won’t work against radical Islam. He therefore feels that the best answer is reforming American immigration policy to try to prevent radical Islam from reaching America in the first place.

    DK, did I get that right?

    Personally, I’m very much on the fence about this. I want very badly to believe in the moderating power of the American melting pot. But I also see more and more examples that seem to be proving DK right. And that concerns me greatly, because on the one hand I fear that enacting explicitly anti-radical-Islamic immigration policies will only inflame tensions further, but on the other hand I fear that continuing with the status quo is going to lead to a massive home-turf battle against radical political Islam.

    It’s amazing how intolerance is able to grab tolerance by the balls so often.

  • themicah,

    I am very dubious that a large Muslim immigration will not prove just as problematic as what is happening in Europe, correct. I think the best way to approach this–and a way to avoid explicitly anti-Islamic immigrant legislation — is to consider immigration reform and reduction generally, particularly now, as we have an increasing labor surplus because of economic problems.

    Constant mass immigration should not be a given at all times. Please see Dan Stein’s organization, FAIR http://www.fairus.org/site/PageServer

    Additionally, as a fiscal Leftist, I am quite bothered that corporate America is using a constant flow of immigrant labor — both legal and illegal — in order to depress worker wages and benefits. It’s one thing for Neocons to side with big business (duh!) but it’s quite another for Jewish Leftists to pretend this isn’t a significant driving force for current immigration levels and lack of enforcement.

    And the thing is, themicah, if my fears prove warranted, there is no way to put the Islamic genie back in the bottle. Jews have a lot to lose. Both in the U.S., and in Israel. I made my appeal on this site because though I have a very different P.O.V. than my Zionist friends on many issues, we do share a common concern over Islamicism, and they are not fooled by Marxist interpretations/excuses for its rise and appeal.

    I am heartened that Marty Peretz has recently joined in to voice is concern about Muslim mass immigration. In addition to his role as TNR macher, Peretz is a direct paternal descendant of the grand Yiddish writer, Y.L. Peretz, a maskil writer. His voice is an important one in this matter.

  • I for one welcome the Islamization of the Netherlands. Over 60% of the country lies beneath mean sea-level and their minarets are not going to help them.

  • DK, this is a wonderful answer to some WN’s who complain about the double standard WRT immigration to Israel or America. We need more of this. I especially like the Biblical reference, even though I didn’t understand it.

    Ephraim, Vlaams Belang is the most pro-Israel party in Europe. Sure, their origins are icky, but they’ve worked hard to purge the anti-semites. Now they are mainstream. Please read the blog Gates of Vienna, a philo-semitic blog about the Jihad in Europe. GoV supports Vlaams Belang. The site owners know Filip Dewinter, and believe me, the GoV people wouldn’t work with him if he weren’t okay.

  • While I certainly do not ignore all issues Europe has got with immigrants from predominantly Muslim countries, I do still wonder where that Jihad is taking place as I haven’t witnessed it yet in those almost three decades that I’ve been living in Europe. Must have been while I was on vacation.

  • i knew it, all jews are anti muslim, typical, thanks ck,
    for showing your true colours
    god i hate it that assholes like you can go to the sinai and give dollars to beduin arabs and take pictures of them,

    there should be a campaign to stop israeli tourists from visiting egypt and even jordan, as for europe, fuck it,

    europeans were dying even before muslims came along, check out their birth rate, if its not muslims, its always some other minority who are blamed for their problems

    you assholes can keep europe, after all you have a wonderful history with them,lol

    from now on i am going to tell evey beduin arab and any arab i meet what israeli smiling tourists who visit egypt are like, a bunch of muslim hating creeps,if only all the arabs read jewish blogs
    adios

  • no one is forcing europe europe to accept muslims, why dont they take workers from south america or even china??

    if muslims are so bad, why the hell do the europeans accept them???

    what a stupid argument, if europeans dont like muslims, thats fine, dont accept them, but you people make an issue out of everything, crying, making controversies

    you are all messed up in the head, bunch of creeps

  • I for one welcome the Islamization of the Netherlands. Over 60% of the country lies beneath mean sea-level and their minarets are not going to help them…….abu zibby

    yeah i can see your love for the netherlands,

    you are complaining that muslims are going to ruin europe but at the same time happy that netherlands is going to sink,yeah you are soooooooo much better than the muslims,god what a creepy statement

    abu zibby, maybe if your jewish ancestors didnt make such comments, you wouldnt have had the holocaust

  • long beach chasid, actually its the neo nazis who are marching with jews against muslims

    also israel also has neo nazis, thats right ethnically jewish neo nazis, since you are a jew, i would love for you to explain how there can be jewish neo nazis, maybe its not surprising considering the fact that you have capos

    also read the jewish blog jewcy.com, they have a story on neo nazis and jews uniting against muslims

    maybe this is jewish diversity,lol

  • there should be a campaign to stop israeli tourists from visiting egypt and even jordan, as for europe, fuck it,

    For what? Not being for Muslim immigration to the West? And should Saudi Arabia be banned for not allowing non-Muslims to become citizens? And what of Iran? Why are the Bahai and Zoorastrians diasporas not wooed back? Where are the non-Muslim mass migrations to Egypt?

    Same/different model. For a change.

  • DK those countries dont need immigration, look at mexico’s birth rate, countries with high birth rates dont need immigration,

    as for europe, do i need to tell you how europeans are?they always look for a scapegoat, always, after ww2 there was a shortage of workers in germany and france, thats how muslim immigration started in europe, but do the europeans admit that?

    why didnt the europeans import workers from south america,china???

    because they were racist thats why, they knew that muslims werent going to marry their white daughters in mass numbers,

    but south americans and non white christians find it easy to marry white christian women, go to any east german town and see for yourself, their dream of white purity is an economic disaster, where are the muslim ghettos in those towns?????

    as for the sinai, its simple, if you dont like muslims, why the hell would you visit it????

    would you like it if arabs visited your neighborhoods??

    jews who visit the sinai are hypocrites, pure and simple

    as for the dutch politician, he wanted to ban the holy quran,calling it violent, then muslims challenged him to compare it to the bible and the torah and talmud, the idiot didnt even take the challenge, what a joke

    as for ayan hirsi ali, she lied about her status, she is a law breaker according to dutch law, what a joke she is, she herself is an illegal immigrant and she criticises legal immigrants,what a joke

    and one more thing, do you jews own europe and america?

    who are you to criticise latino immigration to america

    read abu zibby’s comment and then you will understand why people call you asshole, asshole

  • as for the sinai, its simple, if you dont like muslims, why the hell would you visit it?

    This isn’t about liking or not liking Muslims. This is your false interpretation.

    who are you to criticise latino immigration to america

    I can and will criticize whatever and whomever I want. This isn’t Holland.

  • However, these same Jews, who are so passionate about the Torah’s “endorsement” of mass immigration (to the U.S.) concurrently ignore a blatant and specific warning from Sarah that Yishmael will “play” with Yitzchok while a birthright is being contested if they are found inside the same house…from the article

    you jews can take your birth right, we dont need it, your concept of the chosen race has served you well all these years,

    all human beings are equal, it doesnt matter what race you belong to, or who your father is,

    the world has 6 billion human beings, all human beings are loved equally by god,god is not for the “”jews”” only

    we arabs and muslims believe that people are judged by their actions, not by their race and blood, you jews always bring up the name ishmael as if he is some kind of boogeyman, so tell me why would god save ishmael if he was so bad??????

    thats something your sages cant explain, they say his father was abraham, so for a human being to be chosen, he has to have a link to abraham?????????

    what about africans?what about chinese?indians?south americans??

    thats something you cant grasp either

    you jews are a horrible racist ignorant foul mouthed brutal ethnocentric arrogant people, you always talk about being the chosen people, and you ignore the plight of non jews but if non jews dont care about you, you shout “anti semitism anti semitsm”

    you will get what you give,its that simple

  • we arabs and muslims believe that people are judged by their actions, not by their race and blood

    Oh, sure — provided they do things your way. Provided they submit. And while there is plenty that is too liberal for the Muslim Arab rulers, precious little is too brutal to be incorporated.

  • if you jews are free to criticise latino immigration to america, then fine, latinos and other ehtnic groups should have the freedom to criticise jewish influence and communities in america, withou being called anti semites

    there have been fights between jews and non jews in mixed neighborhoods in america, with tensions running high,
    when ever a non jew complains about jewish thugs to the police in ny, they are called thugs

    thats why jews like you are against immigration, you want jews to control everything in america, but when some other ethnic group critices you scream “anti semite”

    the new york post has published a story about how a jewish orthodox man was arrested for molesting an elderly man in an hospital, after he was arrested, the whole community screamed anti aemitism, despite the fact that lots of witnesses caught him red handed

  • the new york post has published a story about how a jewish orthodox man was arrested for molesting an elderly man in an hospital, after he was arrested, the whole community screamed anti aemitism, despite the fact that lots of witnesses caught him red handed

    Huh? No, you don’t know what you are talking about. But Jews should whine about anti-semitism less. I’ll give you that.

  • DK there are millions of arabs in south america, so tell me why isnt hasnt there been a back lash against arabs in south america????

    i will tell you why, first of all, we dont make comments like your friend abu zibby,

    second we dont claim to be special and claim special treatment

    third we dont boast about being rich and succesful and rub it into peoples noses, and yes there are many rich commercially thriving arabs in south america

    there are also many arab christian politcians who have been elected into political offices(muslims due to their muslim names cant be elected)

    and most importantly, we dont say stupud stuff like “we killed jesus”(read your talmud)

    if you are going to live near christians, dont go around saying you are a rich banker who killed jesus, christians dont like that

    and lastly, we dont try to control their military undustiral complex

  • there are also many arab christian politcians who have been elected into political offices(muslims due to their muslim names cant be elected)

    Then they may not really be Arabs, right? They may be other people, such as Maronites, who do not consider themselves Arab at all.

    So they aren’t really Arab, they definitely aren’t Muslim, and you are bringing them as proof of Arab Muslims because…

    second we dont claim to be special and claim special treatment

    Special treatment is consistently demanded by Muslims in European cities in a myriad of ways.

    and lastly, we dont try to control their military undustiral complex

    Whatever, you *just* control the oil that runs everything. How is that not significant power?

    and most importantly, we dont say stupud stuff like “we killed jesus”(read your talmud)

    Which book, chapter and verse of the Talmud does it say that?

  • how do you explain tensions between blacks and jews and also between jews and other ethnic groups in america?

    your torah says it is ishmael who will be hated because he is a “wild man” but it seems it is jews who are hated

    after 9/11 there was a back lash against muslims, muslims responded by saying all americans can read the holy quran and judge muslims, despite american red necks and rabid jewish right wingers, muslims have achieved great success thanks to the openness of islam,muslims also they are good citizens of america,contributing to society

    if judaism was as open as islam, there would not have been any holocaust

  • your torah says it is ishmael who will be hated because he is a “wild man” but it seems it is jews who are hated

    Nothing about Ishmael being “hated.” And there are nice things said about Yishmael in Judaism as well.

    if judaism was as open as islam, there would not have been any holocaust

    If only Judaism was as angry at the world as Islam frequently is and offered a less text-centered version for the ignorant, perhaps we could pick up a few million converts in maximum security prisons the way Islam has.

  • CTC, I see you’ve got a new name, but your concepts of Europe are just as way off as they used to be.

    An interesting note in this context, at a university nearby the Muslim student body held a “debate” tonight on “60 years of Israel. 60 years of oppression”. Guess who attended to challenge those “speakers”? Professors from the Catholic and Protestant theology faculties. I know a few of them, and they’re as philanthropic and balanced as it gets. I should like to see more moderate Muslims speaking out against the demagogues.

  • I’ll be thinking about Muslim “great success” (Borat?!?) when I get deployed to that neck of the woods towards the end of the year.

  • latte island, I’m aware that Vlaams Belang has (appeared to) change its stripes, but I remain dubious. Also, I’m not sure whether Jews should get too closely mixed up with a party that has such racist roots.

    However, the plain fact of the matter is that where the rubber meets the road, only the European nativists are sticking up for Europe and “European values”. I put that in quotes because I’m sure that there are various definitons. For now, let us accept that they are what Wilders says they are: dedication to an open, tolerant, secular, pluralist society. With this charge against Wilders, it is clear that for whatever reason, there is a strong strain in Holland that is determined to quash any discussion of the issues Wilders raises. So much for pluralism and tolerance.

    CTC/GMAB is right about one thing, though: Europeans do not reproduce in sufficient numbers to produce the workers needed to support the European model of cradle-to-grave social welfare. Thus, they need workers. So, the Muslim world is to Europe what Mexico is for the US: a source of cheap labor that can be exploited. And europeans don’t like Muslims, and the Muslims return the favor. I expect a racial/religious war to erupt in the not-too-distant future, and I believe it will be very bad. I hope the jews have the sense to leave before that happens.

    As for the Sinai, Egypt and Jordan: I agree. You can have them. I think I’d like to see Petra, but Egypt? Mnyeh.

  • do you want me to find the talmud verses where you are calling jesus bad names, saying he should be killed, and his father was a roman soldier????

    as for muslim converts, check out indonesia, 200 million east asians, there are also 20 million chinese muslims, so how do you explain that????

    few million prisoners????……..yeah right, nice try,

    here are the torah verses where it says ishmael is a wild man and will be hated

    Behold, you will conceive, and give birth to a son; you shall name him Ishmael, for Hashem has heard your prayer. And he shall be a wild man – his hand against everyone, and everyone’s hand against him; and over all his brothers shall he dwell.” (Genesis 16:11-12)

    so it seems your sages relegated ishmael as a wild man and hated person, but when abraham brought back hegar after sarah died and ishmael attended the burial of abraham, your sages changed the view, saying ishmael was reformed, what a bunch of racist assholes you jews are

    just because ishmael was half egyptian he was called a wild man, well can you jews explain why the pharoenic egyptian civilization was always greater and outlasted the ancient israeli one, if the egyptians were wild i doubt they would have been able to build their civilization

    i have found hundreds of jewish websites using this verse to justify racism towards arabs, just like white americans used the bible to justify slavery

    DK it seems i know more about the torah than you do, you should be ashamed

    as for muslim converts, they are a source of strength , you jews are elitist and exclusive, and look where that got you

    as for ishmael being a wild man, yeah he was so wild that his ancestors built cities and civilizations well after israel was dust, so tell me DK if ishamel was such a wild man why did your god show him favour and allowed him to thrive??????

    why did god allow israel to be destroyed by the pharoe shishak,greeks,romans,babylonians???

    and one more thing, most muslims are not descended from ishmael, so the jewish argument of ishmael holds no value

    dk talking with you has been an eye opener

    this is what jews believe:

    1. muslim diversity is a lie(despite the fact 75% of muslims are non arabs

    2.jews are always right even though the evidence points to the contrary

    3.ishmael was a wild man and so arabs deserve to be insulted and degraded(your european brothers treated you the way you wanted the arabs to be treated, poetic justice at its finest)

    4.islam is violent(despite the fact that the bible and torah openly call for genocide against people,like the amalekites,canaanites etc, while the holy quran calls for conversion

    proof of muslim converts as being the strength, Arab general khalid bin walid was an enemy of islam who fought against the first muslims, but he later converted to islam and led the muslim armies against the two superpowers of their time, the byzantine and the persian empire, he was so successful that he won a hundred battles and is regarded as one of the greatest generals of all time

    6.jews dont like converts, the result, hatred,suspicion,pogroms,racism, war, destruction,punishment from god

    the proof:jews who criticised the skin colour of the wife of moses, the punishment from god, god gave them leprosy

    7.jews believe the arabs will die out

    8.jews believe that god created 6 billion people for nothing and only jews can be saved, the result, god kills jews and destroys their cities every hundred years, the proof is from the torah.

    Ephraim i am happy you dont want to go to any arab country,good, we dont need you, and you dont need us, so please stop taking our land and go back to your brothers the europeans,

    as for wilders, something tells me this guy will be arrested in the future for having gay sex with minors, remember the christian anti muslim preacher ted haggerd, he called muslims horrible names, but he later got caught trying to solicit sex from a homosexual, what a joke your friends the christian evangelists are, all scumbags of the highest order

    your friend bush ruined the worlds largest economy and no one wants to associate with him, white american red neck christians and jews are all the same

  • brazilian jew lat me tell you about muslim success, first of all

    1.muslims in rwanda saved so many people from genocide that the catholic church there has sent a letter to the vatican because rwandan catholics are converting to islam in large numbers

    did you jews ever in your history have even tried to save an entire group from genocide???????

    2.Muslim contribution to the american economy…….more than 1 trillion dollars, more than the jews, and no we didnt have any bernad madoffs

    3.muslim contribution to global trade……lets see, it was the muslim traders who brought trade between the east and west

  • one last thing, america is a nation that runs on debt, time and time again i have heard again how muslims are poorer etc

    so god above has given you a good punishment, america’s gdp is 13 trillion, but its debt is 40 trillion, now that is justice from god above

    you laughed at the suffering of poor people, now you are borrowing money from china just to survive, what a fucking joke america is, get ready to sell your nations asset assholes

  • Oh, I almost forgot. “Give Me a Break,” can you explain the following verse to me and let me know how it’s influenced Muslims and converts to Islam over the centuries? I’m having trouble understanding it.

    “I will cast terror into the hearts of those who disbelieve. Therefore strike off their heads and strike off every fingertip of them.”

  • dk talking with you has been an eye opener

    Oh, sure. You were a real middle-of-the-road moderate beforehand.

  • themiddle you didnt give me the verse number and passage number, so how can i check it?

    i gave the verse number from the torah didnt i

    abu zibby tell me how much better you are than the muslims considering the fact that you said you were happy that the netherlands might sink into the sea

    DK actually islam was spread by three ways,tribal alliances,the sword and by arab traders

    the tribal alliances made sure the arabs stayed muslims to reap the benefits of being part of the muslim traders,
    i admit islam was spread by the armies into europe but muslims were kicked out with the jews from spain

    and arab traders spread islam to east asia and africa like indonesia,malaysia,maldives,tanzania etc.

    the proof…asian muslims dont speak arabic and are not arabs racially but they are muslims,if they were forcefully converted than they would be following the arab culture wouldnt they.

    and you guys didnt answer my question, name one single ethnic group you have saved from genocide?

    i can provide the link to the rwandan muslims role in reconciliation efforts in rwanda,

  • Funny. Rwanda is the African partner country of Rhineland-Palatinate, where I live. My father always was very active in a group of college profs that supported education in Rwanda and has always had strong ties to it. I know several people that go to Rwanda regularly for structural aid and research. I’ve met several first-hand witnesses of the genocide and civil war in Rwanda. The claim made above re: Muslims Rwandans saving saving is factually wrong. On the other hand, the father of a Kurdish student told me, if not for Israel there’d be no Kurds anymore as without Israel, nobody in the Middle East would care about human and civil rights.

  • Hey, CTC/GMAB:

    Suck on this, dirtbag:

    http://www.templemount.org/quranland.html

    Even your “holy Koran” and your “prophet” say Israel belongs to us.

    So do as your god tells you to do and let us have what he says belongs to us. Or don’t you follow your own religion? Doesn’t Allah hate unbelievers?

  • The Mandaeans were all but wiped off the map recently. Yet another non-Muslim people bit the dust thanks to Muslim love for “diversity.”

    I don’t tell Israel to accept people they don’t see as their own, but considering the Mandaean origins and that they are truly a peaceful people, it really would have been nice…

  • you people will always be brainwashed, you made racist comments about the wife of moses, what can i expect from you, be happy in lala land jerks

  • CTC/Give Me a Break/Goyim,

    I have never made even a single comment about the wife of Moses, much less a racist one. Now maybe you could answer my question about Sura 8:12: ““I will cast terror into the hearts of those who disbelieve. Therefore strike off their heads and strike off every fingertip of them.”

    Thanks.

  • Hey, Middle:

    So in addition to being a racist nutsack, this guy has multiple personality disorder as well?

    You and ck run this blog. Is there any reason why you don’t just ban his troll ass?

  • Jewlicious is essentially an ethnic nationalist & racist wesbite now. It’s a testament to most American Jews that as ethnically centered & tribal as they can be at times, they generally don’t endorse such racism, prejudice & Kahanist nationalism.

  • VDARE had a big shout-out to Jewlicious: http://blog.vdare.com/archives/2009/01/31/the-kvetcher-gets-serious/

    While I don’t agree with every writer on this important site (unlike with most aggregate sites, with which I agree with every writer on everything because I am such an agreeable person), I would note that the NY Times editorial is disgusting and risible, suggestively blaming intellectual leaders of the immigration reform movement for a murder at the hands of teenage thugs. Look: http://www.nytimes.com/2009/02/01/opinion/01sun1.html?scp=1&sq=nativist&st=cse

    Ephraim, you are mentioned specifically, so don’t forget that I helped make you famous, okay?

  • Cool.

    It’s Ephraim, though, not “Ephraim”.

    It actually is my real Hebrew name.

    Interesting that “nativist” became “atavist”, though.

  • themiddle you have posted the sura out of context, its only for self defense,i can cut and paste the torah too and make it look even worse

  • You think the problem is relegated to Europe. Think again. A federal appeals court in San Francisco in September upheld a death sentence by a jury which had consulted the bible’s pro-capital punishment teachings. The U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals for the 9th Circuit split 9-6, saying bible verses distributed by the jury’s foreman did not require a reversal of the death sentence imposed on Stevie L. Fields in 1979. The foreman, in preparing a list of pros and cons about the death penalty, passed out bible passages such as, “He that smiteth a man, so that he dies, shall surely be put to death.” Dissenter Judge Ronald M. Gould wrote that the majority had confused “a theocratic jury room” in which jurors consider “the death penalty in light of scripture”. So much for the separation of church and state.

  • Whoa! You totally lost any credibility when you reference VDARE. I bet the KKK has your back too!

  • In a previous comment, the writer asks, “Canada has more Muslims than Jews these days, have the Jews or Canadians suffered problems that represent your fears?”
    The answer: YES!!
    Just look at the racism and intimidation directed at Jews on campus in Canada…It behooves us to think carefully about the significance of this for our future. Recently,among a long chain of Canadian campus events, at York U., menacing, hate-spewing students besieged the Hillel lounge. The university and police allowed this to continue and only the Jewish students and others who were in the lounge with them had to change their schedules. They were escorted out by the police, forced to walk through a throng of threatening impromptu demonstrators. Despite Canada’s anti-hate laws, those shouting invective were not disbursed or charged and those sitting peacefully in the lounge were subjected to fear and humiliation. The hateful behaviour is often condoned by officials and the public now. If Canada’s younger generation is influenced by well-paid “influencers” (a marketing term), intent on changing the outlook of society to draw it into Islamic points of view, and the older generation (administration, government, police) ‘sits by idly while their brothers blood is spilled’ (the Jews…canaries in the mine), what is the outlook for it remaining a democracy in the future and what is the outlook for non-Islamists living the life Canada has strived for.

  • hey, givemeabreak, as a british non-jewish atheist:

    FUCK YOU and your “religion of peace.”

    i have seen all of the nonsense antisemitic propoganda you’ve posted plenty of times (unfortunately, i’m in london), and it’s just that : nonsense.

  • Don’t for Geert Wilders!
    Stop talking, start acting.
    Isn’t Geert’s freedom worth a stamp?

    If Geert Wilders falls, then Freedom of speech is dead in Europe. We are launching an extensive International Action SITA including two possible texts ; one comparing Wilders and Winston Churchill and another Wilders and Charlie Chaplin:

    http://sitamnesty.wordpress.com/2009/01/23/i-support-democrat-geert-winston-wilders-against-islamic-fascism-and-its-dhimmis

    http://sitamnesty.wordpress.com/2009/01/23/i-support-democrat-geert-charlie-wilders-against-islamic-fascism

    To support Geert Wilders and our dearly acquired freedoms please participate to the 2 suggested actions and transmit this message to your friends owners of a website in order they publish it.

    An other way to support Geert Wilders is to give some money. To donate: http://www.geertwilders.nl

  • Wondering what you folks would say if this guy was doing exactly the same stuff but against us? I’m sick and tired of what we are. Can we not see that at the end of the day it will be Muslims who save us? It’s been so all thru centuries. We are the same, we are minorities and there is neo-antisemitism against Arabs in the west. Why are we so wicked and hypocritical! And then we wonder why we are hated since times immemorial. Read some Gilad Atzmon and get educated. Torah, Nevyim, Ketuvim=Taurat, Nabiun, Kitabun. Hebrew=Arabic. Shalom=Salaam.

  • the give me a break, we the Jews never save anybody but ourselves. We are the most insulal, tribalistic and brutal victims. Of all times. We can shell schools and hospitals, drop white phosphorus on unprotected civilians/concentration camp prisoners and claim we are “reacting” and “defending” ourselves. We kill infants and children because we wanna spare the hassle of killing them later, when, supposedly (in the Jewish psyche), they will turn into terrorists. That’s what we are.

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