If you are one of those fliers who is sick of secular movies, hottie flight attendants whose mere presence suggest the far-off but enjoyable fantasy of joining a mile high club, crappy non-kosher food and having to sit near your non-same-sex partner, you may be in good shape come Pesach. About 20,000 haredi students cross the pond and then some to come home during Pesach. The flights will be known as Mehadrin flights and it is still unclear whether or not El Al will comply with demands to not raise rates in response to demand come the pesach season. From Jpost. Muffti had to chuckle at the final sentence (bolded).

In another example of how market forces serve religious faith, El Al is in advanced negotiations with representatives of the haredi community to provide super kosher or “Mehadrin” flights.

If the deal between the sides is sealed, the flights, which would begin this Pessah season, would adhere to strict gender separation, Glatt kosher food and no secular on-flight movies.

The gender separation would include male flight attendants for haredi male travelers. Haredi females would be served by both male and female flight attendants.

However, haredi sources said that most of the flights would be filled with young American men who study in Israeli yeshivot.

A source in El Al said that management had already agreed in principle to the haredi request. Management has not yet decided whether it will forgo the seasonal rise in price during Pessah, as the haredim are requesting.

However, an official El Al spokesman said that no final decision had been made yet.

The story was first published in the haredi Internet news service Le’Da’atNet.

Rabbi Yitzhak Goldknopf of the Council for the Sanctity of the Shabbat and Rabbi Yitzhak Meir Safronovitch of the Council for the Purity of the Camp met with El Al’s executive management last month.

Goldknopf said that there had been a “very positive” atmosphere during the meeting.

“[El Al CEO] Haim Romano agreed in principle to the request and asked management to look into the logistics of implementing it,” he said.

Goldknopf argued that the move made sense economically since there were “about 20,000 haredi yeshiva students who return to the US during the Pessah vacation.”

“These are customers who demand special conditions and in this era of consumerism, businesses cannot ignore the demands of their clientele.”

The Mehadrin flights, if approved, would not be added to the airline’s flight schedule, but would modify existing flights to meet the haredi travelers’ needs. Secular travelers would be concentrated on regular flights. Goldknopf did not rule out the possibility that if El Al were to cater to yeshiva students, it would enjoy a higher demand, since travelers would now opt for El Al.

Last year El Al and the Council for the Sanctity of the Shabbat, which is controlled by the Ger Hassidic Sect, reached an agreement according to which El Al planes would refrain from flying on Shabbat.

The agreement was made after a short-lived haredi boycott against El Al. The boycott was in protest against a publicized incident at the end of 2006 in which the airline desecrated Shabbat by flying Israelis stranded during a general strike that shut down Ben-Gurion Airport.

El Al later later agreed that Chief Sephardi Rabbi Shlomo Amar would be the halachic arbiter on when the national carrier could and could not desecrate Shabbat.

Since the agreement was reached between El Al and the haredim, relations have been very good, said Goldknopf.

“I believe El Al is blessed from the heavens with economic success thanks to its willingness to respect Shabbat.”

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54 Comments

  • LoBiCh, krechts nit. You’ll get your sex orgy in SanFran if that is what your heart desires.

    As far as I have experienced, yeshiva bochurim do not mind so much being on secular flights.

  • I guess Im lucky you care more about my pretty little heart than you do writing blog entries that have substance to them. If not, then I would never have anything to say.

  • There’s more than a little bias in this piece.

    There’s nothing nefarious about a company catering to its customers, and giving them what they want.

    It’s called “service”.

    Only when it’s “haredi dollars” (cue ominous music) does it suddenly become inappropriate.

    We have enough double-standard reporting on Gaza right now. Why don’t you post about atheism?

  • Jewlicious.com derives sustenance from criticizing the Haredi World.

    Thats not the issue I take with these articles.

    I criticize them because people like Muffti’s entire understanding of Orthodox Jewish life seems to be limited to his Google Searching skills.

    Another reason is the articles are usually written from a whiny, complaining stance, with absolutely no suggestion as to how to “fix” the issue.

    The flights are select and for a limited time. You act as if there is a Haredi take over and now you are going to have to resort to flying Air Swiss through Zurich.

    Boo Hoo. Kosher meals, no movies (as if you dont own a sweet Ipod video) and you dont get to sit next to a girl for 14 hours. These Religious Jews are such meanies.

  • OK, this is ridiculous. Muffti has never seen you guys go off the hook and impose a tone on a ‘piece’ that was honestly meant completely tongue and cheek.

    Muffti completely agrees that providing your customers with service is a totally appropriate and non-nefarious thing to do and is happy (he swears!) that El Al runs an airline that can meet the needs of haredi jews.

    Look, Muffti likes to think we are friends, or, whatever, at least not enemies. So take a little cajoling in the sense it’s meant and realize that the ominous tone is all in your head.

  • ‘Google Searching’ taught Muffti everything he knows about philosophy, LBC, so back off.

  • I thought that by using the terms “boo hoo” and “meanie” would give some sort of sign that i didnt go to bed angry.

    Seriously though, “Google Searching” is better than most Bachelor Degrees.

    I am still mad Jewlicious didnt write an article about the Tel Aviv sex orgy that was disbanded by Angry Religious Jews.

  • if your biggest customers wat a service you give it. exact reason why the wordwide advertising industry is nothing but sex money and airbrushed anorexic women.

    how I love living in the secular theocracy

  • I thought it was the Red Queen who said that a word meant what she meant it to mean when she said it.

  • one thing i have always noticed with you guys is that you say palestinians have to learn to live with you or they will suffer the consequences, ok fine

    so can you please tell me if you jews are such a fine peace loving people why did you carry out the hebron riots and firebomb palestinian homes???

    if a palestian firebombs an israeli house, he is killed by an f-16, but if an israeli does it he gets nothing?

    and can you justify why you kidnap children and force their parents to be informants???if you dont believe me google administrative detention of palestinian teenagers

    this is the deal you are offering all palestinians

    live next to israeli settlements, if they burn your fields,dont fight back, if you are randomly beaten up, dont fight back, if your pregnant wife dies in a checkpoint because some israeli soldier decides to have some fun even though she had the right papers and even if she was going to a palestinian hospital, please dont fight back.

    the soldier i mentioned got only 2 weeks suspension, thats it

    so there you go, and dont tell me these are isolated incidents, the idf have confirmed that even before the gaza war these incidents are common place.

    if a palestinian attacks, he is killed by bombs or bullets, ok

    but if an israeli attacks, palestinian policeman cant even arrets them, what the hell is that???

    your poodle abbas couldnt even deploy palestinian policeman during the hebron riots, and the funny thing is those rioters were forced out by the israeli courts, not the palestinian court, what the hell is that????

    but what do you and america and the rich arabs care, after all we are only palestinians , we are used as a political tool.

    i just want to say one more thing, even with moses,david,solomon and all the prophets you have always crashed and burn, always.

    god only allowed to drown the egyptian pharoe but did god destroy egypt or even germany???

    israelis have told me not to be bitter and pray for coexistence, well

  • lol, they can never explain why the state of israel allows settler abuse of palestinians.

    the settlers are all typical skull cap wearing jews, you are all rascist as hell

  • whats with the name grandmuffti???

    i mean is it to piss of arabs?

    would you guys be pissed of if an arab called himself kahane???

  • not meanies…just really creepy and perverted. The real world has a diversity of races and sexes, deal with it. If you can’t handle sitting next to a woman or seeing a movie without controlling your own impure thoughts, what kind of self-mastery and self-discipline has all your Jewish learning imparted on you? None.

  • Its all or nothing with you anti religious types

    There is no give and take.

    What has all my learning imparted on me?

    I will tell you one thing.

    Ahavas Yisroel.

    Not matter how crude and condescending and critical you are I am commanded to love you as i love my own mother.

    That is a more difficult mitzvah to fulfill than keeping my mind pure when there is a girl 1/2 naked on the bus next to me because she cant get a guy with her brain or hold an intelligent conversation.

  • LoBiCh, first of all, who told you I was anti-religious? Just because I don’t go fully in line with a Christianized knock-off of Judaism that is barely a few centuries old doesn’t mean I don’t care for Judaism.

    Secondly, while there are without a doubt slutty girls galore in the secular world, to reduce the personality of a person to a stereotype based on their looks is neither mature nor smart. I could in return claim that any frum seminary girl hasn’t got enough intellectual substance to get involved in a decent conversation. I could even back that claim by my experiences of a dozen years among / with Charedim.

  • Froylein I wasnt responding to you, I was responding to Chutzpah.

    Christianized knock off of Judaism? Please explain what Christian influences have infiltrated the Chassidic Movement, that is what you are speaking about no?

    I have no will to argue this point with you. There are very smart girls who just want to “feel good” and they think that (or the world at large has made them believe) that the more skin you show the prettier you are. Still, statistically most girls that dress that way either are unable to excel intellectually, or are brainwashed into thinking they cant. As for the Frum side of things since we cant criticize the Secular world without reminding everyone that the secular world isnt a picture perfect Disney film. You are right, there are many modestly dressed girls in the Torah observant world that are dumb as a rock. When a guy sees a girl in a short dress with cleavage showing, is he really thinking “WOW I cant wait to discuss advances in neuroscience!” Now it could be that this slutty dressed woman is actually a Pre Med student at UCLA, but the odds slim.

    I applaud you for spending dozens of years among Charedim, which qualifies you to criticize and point out their flaws on the internet. Except in this Christian Knock Jewish Religion the Internet is Assur so the people that are actually reading your writing are uneducated secular Jews who will be brainwashed into thinking there is nothing Good in Torah Judaism.

    I know you disagree with everything I have just said and will attempt to explain how I “got it all wrong” So just say your peace have the last word and well move on to the next exciting blog post.

    —-

    How come no one has responded to the Palestinian Sympathizer?

  • ‘When I use a word,’ Humpty Dumpty said, in a rather scornful tone,’ it means just what I choose it to mean, neither more nor less.’
    ‘The question is,’ said Alice, ‘whether you can make words mean so many different things.’
    ‘The question is,’ said Humpty Dumpty, ‘which is to be master – that’s all.’

    There’s glory for you.

    Goyim, Muffti isn’t trying to piss anyone off – and no one has ever registered offense to the name. Arabs can go around using the name ‘Kahane all they like so far as the Muffti is concerned. Turning a blind eye to settler abuse is nothing short of disgusting, at least in Muffti’s opinion.

  • When a guy sees a girl in a short dress with cleavage showing, is he really thinking “WOW I cant wait to discuss advances in neuroscience!”

    Yeah, mind you, not too many girls Muffti knows who dress with their breasts covered and a skirt line below their knees report many incidences of men walking and saying ‘hey darlin’, care to discuss the occipital lobe?’

    In any case, Mufftti presents the following as counterexample:

    Pre-Med babe

    She is pre-med as proven here here.

    Very few people are successful pre-med students and please show Muffti these correlations you site between dressing all slutty-like and academic performance. Muffti thinks, truthfully, you’re full of shit on this one.

  • 1) hehehe…that’s a famous one. We can trade pics of pretty girls being smart and stupid all day long, and Muffti might even enjoy it. But to what purpose? You want to claim a correlation between bad performance academically and Muffti is asking for a li’l bit of proof.

    2) Justification for girls that dress slutty? Muffti doesn’t have to justify dressing sluttily and neither do girls who dress slutty. Surely when it comes to something like that there are any number of different reasons people do it. What is your justification for girls who don’t dress slutty? (Muffti isn’t trying to be rude – he’s just not sure what you are asking for).

  • In pious countries, women keep their breasts, posteriors, legs, heads, and faces covered at all times– or assume the risk of an edifying faceful of acid. If only we were so G-dly.

    I wish Muffti hadn’t posted the photo of the immodest Bruin slut. It led to an evil thought– so evil it involved sexuality– utterly degrading…. I do not visit this site to be confronted with images like this. Please.

  • Hey, “goyim”, unless you have multiple personality disorder or there’s more than one of you posting, it’s “goy”, singular. “Goyim” is plural.

    Of course, in your case, “paskudnyak” would be a better handle, I think. Or “goyische kop”. Either one would suit you.

  • No more pre-meds. If you must post photos, please make them of phys. ed. majors at CSU Chico.

  • The focus on spirituality and mysticism (and, as some reputable religious Jewish historians state, even the notion of messianism as it exists in Chasidism) were adoptions from Christianity and do not reflect what religious Judaism typically was like before the Jewish Enlightment triggered Orthodoxy as its counterpart.

    Despite what you claim, many Chasidim use the internet, and there has been an ongoing discussion among leading religious figures as how to gauge its benefits vs its risks (which, BTW, is closely related to the discussion of the concerns secular parents have about their kids using the internet). Even Chasidishe rabbis access the internet. I resent the notion that I was brainwashing secular Jews into believing that there was nothing good to be gained out of Torah Judaism. I just wish to get people to critically reflect the role of self-acclaimed religious / social authorities and not take them for the norma normans of Judaism as they are not. They are a variety of Judaism.

    As for the clothing, since the idea of what constitutes as tzniusdik clothing even clashes with what would be considered proper business attire in the secular world, where men do not get aroused from spotting a woman’s collar bone or the lower half of her kneecap, I dare say the vast majority of secular men does not fantasize about mating when he sees a woman in a regular blouse and knee-length skirt.

    As for the lady in that picture, she’d not be considered particularly attractive in Europe as her eyes are puffy and without sparkle.

  • Ephraim, “goyim” is the same person as “simple guy” and “we are human too”. I think the more we respond to him, the more he may feel tempted to spew his propaganda here.

  • ‘Paskudnyak’ means ‘shlemiel’ in the Cree language of northern Quebec.

  • tom morrisay only one guy was known to have thrown acid on womans face, and he is currently an american ally, yup you guessed it, he is an afghan warlord,and the americans call him a friend,because he is not a member of the taliban.
    but considering the fact that a jew was guilty of murdering his own daughter and granddaughter(yes i am talking about the guy who killed the french jewish girl rose pizem), every society has its monsters.

    even in saudi arabia women can show their face, its pretty stupid to stereotype arabs as all backwards , its like saying all jewish people are greedy money hungry economy destroying bankers who ruin the countries they stay in, sort of like pre ww1 and ww2 germany and today america is in a financial collapse, thanks to people like bernard madoff.

    in america there is a lot of anger against jews thanks to the collapse of lehman brothers,bear stern,madoff scandall,this time you really are guilty arent you,you know what maybe its good to be a backward arab stuck in the desert rather than a jew in america, especially when the shit hits the fan eh.

    and one more thing, america is borrowing money from poorer countries to survive, how fucking lame is that, what kind of assholes borrow money from the poor??

    china is poorer than america but america borrows daily 2 billion dollars from the chinese, so go figure.

    at least the oil arabs sell is their own, while fat americans borrow money to lead a good life style.

    as for abuse of woman, let me ask you tom morrisay, are you saying the orthodox jews dont attack immodest women???

    do you guys want me to post articles where jews have attacked woman for not wearing the right clothes?

    and i find it shameful that men are threatened by confident women, the first muslim women actually fought on the battlefield against armies, but you jews have the story of esther who prostituted herself to a persian king, and its in your torah and you even celebrate it,lol.

    one more thing, can anyone please explain it to me why bernard madoff isnt in jail yet, or is america so blind to your crimes that you can do anything you want and ruin their lives and waste their money.(do i need to mention jewish bear stern and lehman brothers executives)

  • You are so full of crap Long Beach. The only time Orthos are not criticizing non-observant tribe members is when they are trying to schnor money off of them to support their institutions.

    As for discussions, Orthodox women are not well-versed in topics other than the status of their uterus, sheitels, kids, and where to find good non-Jewish help.

    The only people who use words like “slut” are misogynists. Non-misogynists don’t mind if a woman is enjoying her own sense of style or lack thereof, that is her choice and she is lucky to exercise her freedom of choice. Orthodox women do not enjoy that freedom.

    As for the pre-med cheerleader, she cute and smart. Good for her.

    Ad for how much you love your own mother, odds are you are a bal tshuva and are making fun of her except when she’s giving you money.

  • Long Beach chasid the world wide advertising and media companies are dominated by jews and fundamentalist christians

    funny isnt it, you think they are immoral yet they are israels biggest supporters, hmmm

    lets see, fox news,hollywood,media all contribute HEAVILY to the jewish funds and israel, so Long Beach Chasid your jewish community influence and wealth depends on your marketing of sleaze, you jews have a history of marketing sleaze, like the story of esther,lol.

  • Chutzpah. Im not going to argue with you. It is evident that you find yourself to be an expert in Halacha and what they teach in Seminary.

    Odds are I pray everday I could be a Baal Teshuva. I am a Master of nothing.

    An Aish HaTorah student who became religious later in life once went to the Ger Rebbe and the Rebbe asked where he learns he said “I learn at Aish but dont worry, Im not a Baal Teshuva.” The Ger Rebbe asked him “And why not?!”

    A Baal Teshuva isnt just someone who became religious later in life which I assume you are using the term in a condescending manner. As for my mother she is Frum and I pay for my own Torah learning

    It would be so interesting to have this discussion in person as I feel you arent all such huge ________ as you are on the internet.

    Hope to see you all at Jewlicious Festival!!!

  • AFAIK, “paskudnyak” is Yiddish via Russian/Slavic.

    People who know more Yiddish than I do (and by that I mean people who actually know Yiddish) can correct me if I’m wrong, but it is my understanding that “paskudne” refers to state of thoroughgoing moral corruption, and a “paskudnyak” is a person who embodies those qualities. Most Yiddish insults have a certain playful side to them, but paskudnyak is a term of utter opprobrium. A paskudnyak is a moral degernate, a filthy, disgusting, slimy lowlife with no redeeming characteristics.

    It is, therefore, pretty much the ultimate Yiddish insult if you really, really hate someone.

  • Why isn’t Madoff in jail, GAH?: “No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.” US Const., 14th Amendment, Sec. 1.

  • HELP! This guy is throwing Big Aish stories at me! Somebody stop him before I really lash out!!!

    AND THEN HE TRIES TO HIT ME UP FOR A PERSONAL MEETING!

    I’m warning you Chasid, I am a worse bitch in person and I’ll wear my malfunctioning blouse that I met Froylein in and you’ll have to spend the rest of your life in the mikvah to cleanse yourself from all the impure thoughts I’ll cause you think.

    Dude, get off this blog and go back to Beit Midrash. THIS BLOG IS ASSUR FOR YOU!

  • Chutzpale, that’s why I suggested that if he wants to meet, Kelsey will be there as well. 😉

    I’ll bring a long list of Chasidishe rabbis that use the internet for fun.

  • Yeah, I’ll pass on that invitation Froylein, but hope you and I will connect the next time you are in the States. We’ll go in search of “goyishe flings” as you like to call them.

  • Chutzpah you must be joking. Pardon my ASSumption but i thought since you are so active on this website that you participate in the Jewlicious Festival. Dave doesnt have a problem with me here, so your opinion means as much as that puddle I stepped in when I walking into my apt. complex.

    Oh please dont lash out at me. Im so sheltered worrying about the klippahs all around that I might not know how to defend myself.

    Or maybe I just think you are a cup full of _____ and have heavy fingers on the internet.

    Now.
    Geh Kak afen yam, and shalom.

  • Oy, LoBiCh…

    Anyhow, as far as Muffti once told me, most people he encountered at the Festival were drawn by Rabbi Yonah’s outstanding community / outreach work and hardly, if at all, follow the blog. I’m not sure how many of the bloggers will be attending; I know CK and Lisa will be there as well as Erez, Y-Love and Rabbi Yonah. I suspect Aaron might be there as he doesn’t live far off, and Muffti could drop by to meet up with old friends. I don’t know about the others. As far as I’m concerned, work will keep me from travelling then, plus if I had any intention of making known to the general public what I look like, there’d be an actual picture of me online.

  • Muffti can’t make it unfortunately – a very close friend of his is giving a lecture that weekend at Muffti’s department and staying the weekend (it was schedule before Muffti knew the planned dates for the jewlicious festival). It certainly was a fun time – last time muffti stayed continually buzzed on account of sneaking beers with Kelsey from about 2pm onwards 🙂 Maybe next year.

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