×ויר ×”×¨×™× ×¦×œ×•×œ כיין
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What did you do last Wednesday? What about last Thursday? Well, back here, Jerusalem was host to 2 very different back-to-back festivals. The first was the Wine Festival which took place on the grounds of the Israel Museum. Visitors paid 50 Shekels and were able to sample as much wine as they could handle from a good variety of both large and small Israeli Vineyards.
One could not fail to notice the relative sophistication of the crowd early in the evening as those with some wine knowledge swirled the wine in their glasses, looked at the color, commented on it’s oakiness and the caramel undertones. Of course, as the night went on people just got wasted – I even noticed people drinking chilled Rieslings while holding the goblet rather than the stem! Gasp! How gauche! But you know it was a hot event because all kinds of people were there! Tel Avivians shlepped to Jerusalem! Frum and secular folks mixed comfortably with French olim and the usual anglo suspects who show up wherever booze is plentiful and relatively inexpensive.
Who’s in the pics above? From left to right starting on the first row, we have Enia and our own Leah (who is heading off to Atlanta for her CNN fellowship!), Simone and Yoni, Rebecca and Yoni, some dude and Ahuvah, me smoking a Cuban cigar, Jewlicious Taglit-birthright Israel trip alumna Shira and friend, Leah interviewing Matt Barr, one of the PICZ fellows and random woman 1 and random woman 2 who insisted I photograph them – no problem ladies… Good times, good times. So seriously – what did you do last Wednesday?
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JM, We’ve got to publish some of this stuff. Really. Just gems. Even if you (or we) don’t quite agree. Cheers, ‘VJ’
Right – we have to get firm with our men and also with our children. “You can rebel later, after you graduate” we should say to the children. I am still feeding you, so are still mine, we should think, if not say. That means family first, not your instant messaging friends.
Then the whole thing might be FUN again, and people might actually WANT to do it.
Then I could go back to doing whatever it was I was doing before which I forget what was.
JM we must be good therapy here, right? I think Sarah is also right in noting that ‘I haven’t always experienced the correlation between emotional and financial stinginess’. It can easily occur without this added zinger. I’ve been reasonably stingy FOR Myself, but very giving to family & friends all my life. Cheers, ‘VJ’
Bah, excessive literalism. You can have a job and a ring too, and a kid, and some help with same. Some things don’t change, sir, you can say.
As a professor of mine used to say, “Be consistent.” You want equal rights, equal wages, you want to fulfil yourself at work and at leisure, you want fathers taking over responsibilities besides the monetary ones? Voilá, avec plaisir, but that comes with the terms and conditions in the small print: men are entitled to a new gender role as well. Giyoret, your story tells that you’ve been emotionally and financially abused by an absolute moron. I haven’t always experienced the correlation between emotional and financial stinginess; an ex of mine would shower me with gifts, cards, calls etc. even when I was living abroad because of my studies, but he still was emotionally abusive, which I admitted to myself too late.
Anyhow, I think key is what / who makes you happy; there’s not set recipe that would please each and any tastebud.
Not only are men a runaway shop, parents are also a runaway shop.
You want to be “empowered”, kid? Well, two can play that game. No existence for you. Bam.
No one who uses the word “tween” should be admitted to polite company.
there used to be three phases:
1) I am an infant and / or pre-school and I am really quite physically dependent on you. Sorry for the bother but I can’t help it.
2) I can talk, sleep through, eat with a fork and play with you. This is the “hello. I am your child”. phase.
3) I have separated and while I love you I have to have my own path now. That can be a bit painful, but the parent is proud and remembers the intimacy and fun of phase 2).
Well, today, phase 2) has been eliminated.
From “wah! want bottle!” to “bratz are better than parents!” is the short, direct route, no detours.
People could indeed wonder why bother. When is “you are my sweetie and you like to learn from, and with, me. Let’s play ball, read together, or go ice-skating”?
This is the link
A French woman has a book out about how awful it is to have children. “Enfants Terribles” or something. She has a point! Having children the modern way can indeed lead to a big reduction in the pleasure of it.
The piece mentioned the misery of a father trying to cope with an 18-month-old on a plane ride. What in the name of all that is blue and wonderful is he doing with an 18- month-old on a plane? Modernism run amok.
And the kid culture? Tweens, Ipods, secrecy, excessive ’empowerment’? Yes, with that stuff, you can indeed have a stranger living with you. In the old days, people had fun molding their children to believe what they believed. It worked essentially, although there was the find-yourself thing, if sonny didn’t want to carry on daddy’s business etc. But basically, your children had a lot in common with you, and felt like family. That is fun.
She says the father leaves when the kid arrives. Modern! Terrible! Sure that happened in the past, but was an exception, and it was considered a misfortune, and a wicked thing to do to her. Now, modernity says he is just moving on, no problem. No baseball bat. No broken legs. Nothing.
She says you can’t go anywhere, and you lose your time, and your ambitions and dreams. If you have no sense of purpose, which is the modern disease, well, she has a point! The joy of having children is affirming a sense of purpose.
As for her eco-system concerns, she is just plain silly. That’s just fatigue, and nihilism, with a little ribbon in its hair called I Can Too Think, At Least A Little. A sprig of Philosophy she has stuck in her lapel.
Poor thing. Poor everybody. Resolve to be very old-fashioned in family matters, and the whole thing will be a lot less troublesome.
She has a point that it can be boring taking care of little kids! The challenge is to see what you are really doing, under the placid playground plastic ducks. If you can realize you are fostering a new existence, and you think existence is a good idea and interesting, and you don’t like being alone, and you want someone to really care when you die, well, you do a tough mental exercise called having perspective, and self-discipline.
That involves seeing the unseen. Imagining.
It is therefore religious in flavor and nature, even if you are not at all religious, in the usual sense.
So yes, she is right. Her way. The new way. The modern way. Yuck.
VJ: It’s embarassing–I can be a little too understanding–and it takes me a while to catch on.
Eventually I realized what a pig he was. And I kicked that treif to the curb 🙂
Cheers!
Any guy, making ‘close to 300K’ who a.) does not pay for every date and b.) did not send any gifts to the freelancing single mom should have been shot at the table. And might have been if he lieved & dated in NYC. I agree, Giyoret, ‘economic stinginess correlates to emotional stinginess’, often enough. It’s a testament to your abiding faith and humanity that you did not smother him with his pillow when he was sleeping!
And Chutzpah, make Sir Tom an offer he can’t refuse. It’s worked before! Failing that, find someone in the crowd who might be suitable. Cheers, ‘VJ’
Splitting checks? Does not work. If everyone is gainfully employed, it’s just one of those social things that both parties understand. If I split with a guy, I feel like I’m trying to give him the message that I do not want to want to “owe†him anything and that I am buying the option not to be anything to him. C’mon. It’s not a financial transaction; it’s obviously an emotional one. If you approach dating as a good time, then maybe the splitting makes sense, because it’s entertainment. But if someone is looking for an exclusive, committed relationship, to me the money is just a means of investing in that. I’m not talking about wild extravagance here. If we end up getting married, my money and yours gets thrown in together in some fashion anyway, so how much time really is spent with the guy paying?
I think it demonstrates a willingness not to be petty and keep score. An ex of mine, who had an expense acct. and who was making close to $300k while I was a single mom with a spotty freelance income at the time, would sometimes give me the vibe that I should be paying the check. And I did, like an ass. In 9 months he never bought me a present, or flowers; it was obvious that money had many, many strings attached for him. I did a lot of other things for him and was very supportive. I thought, you know, each person contributes what he/she can and that’s good enough. If we had to limit our going out to what I could afford to reciprocate, we wouldn’t go out to places we were going.
I think economic stinginess correlates to emotional stinginess (it was in that case). Paying for dates, being polite and romantic gestures are significant because they are unequivocal messages: that the guy likes you, is interested in making you happy . Even if he thinks it’s a silly social constraint, a guy who is not willing to play the game demonstrates that he doesn’t care about the message he gives.
Who needs that???
True Sarah…so sleep late and have some mule bring you breakfast in bed.
To be treated like a lady one has to conduct herself like a lady. To quote a friend of mine, “Class is not a facial cream.”
That’s “Sir Tom Jones” to you VJ, and no, he’s not available.
Giyoret, glad you enjoy my shtick…I’m saving the good stuff for my future best-sellers. And ALL Jewish men are “conflicted” in some way.
As to the hair, I HATED my hair growing up and cried over it many, many times from Kindergarten straight through to Law School. Now, after 8 years of covering it with various cheap wigs and expensive ones (never the super expensive ones though) I appreciate every bad hair day I have. I am trying to teach my daughters that where we come from, Long Island, wigs are for cancer victims, and are now be rejected by many proud cancer survivors in favor of showing their bald heads Melissa Ethridge style.
Sarah…please… just because we want to be paid equal wages doesn’t mean we don’t want to be treated like a lady in ‘da street and a freak in ‘da bed. Holding doors open for men and splitting checks…NEVER!
I don’t consider it false pride to take care of yourself if you can and to not sell yourself out for fancy luxuries. If women really want to be emancipated (I’ve recently read that the average wages of women in NYC even exceed those of men), they’ll have to accept split bills and buying flowers on their own. Thinking about it, isn’t it about time that women started holding doors open for men, buy them fancy dinners, drinks and all kinds of pricy accessories? But is all that stuff even important in a relationship? My great-grandmother was born in 1895 and lived through two world wars and the Great Depression; her marriage lasted for about forty years till my great-grandfather’s death in the 1960s. That marriage could only last being based on mutual love, respect, willingness to compromise and a healthy sense of humour. Men are way more than ATMs and sperm banks. Those men that define their personalitiy through ATM- and sperm bank-like qualities lack class.
I say always go to the top dog to get what you want. You want a ‘Tom Jones-loving, lobster-eating sex machine in your future?’ Go for the real thing. I think Mr. Jones might be available for reasonable rates for rent. Really impress him and you might even add to the limited population of Welsh Jews. Just a thought.
And Giyoret, that’s an interesting but not strictly uncommon problem to be having with some dates. I think we need to coin a term for it too. Cheers, ‘VJ’
Chutzpah: Get to work on that blog. I am certain it will help you attract what you want. I swear, I see that Tom Jones-loving, lobster-eating sex machine in your future. I don’t see why you shouldn’t find him. And another thing: writing under your own headings is going to force you to clarify what you’re thinking even more, much more than you already do in your comments (and you’re already good). Congrats on the hair; that is an essential feeling for a woman!
When you and JM get together and the fur starts to fly, that’s some good energy! I’m developing a popcorn reflex when I open Jewlicious; you know, that urge to sit down with a bowl of it and watch the show.
And speaking of JM: what I want to say to you is “Amen†about the spouse material thing, and a lot of your posts in general. Why waste time? Especially when you are no longer 20 years old, and have enough to offer that you also have a right to expect quite a bit. It’s funny, when I was in my 20’s I might have thought that your advice about marriage was very old-fashioned and quaintly delusional, but now I see it differently. “No zapping hunger pangs with candy bars†sounds pretty solid. Rights and obligations are starting to sound like nice little fences to wrap around relationships. Everyone understands the boundaries. And why don’t people ask for them? They’re afraid to “demand†anything for fear of being seen as demanding. Do you know how many lost DMs are out there, hoping for a good time? I realize JM, you are mostly talking about young people and families and babies, but it applies even to those of us moving toward the end of that phase, who still want a stable, happy family life.
Speaking of which (and this is just a momentary rant) I hope I stop attracting conflicted Jewish men. Lured and reassured by the apparent “otherness†of my Shiksappeal, they are thrown for a loop when they discover that I am not going to reject their Jewishness (FOR them, BTW) and that I actually like it. My enthusiasm for Judaism baffles them. They are very uncomfortable when they find they can’t run away from anything through me. I just hope I meet a normal guy one of these days.
::heavy sigh::
False pride is foolish. A women should absolutely be financially independent and then have the men pay for all her luxuries on top of that, including a really big life insurance policy incase he drops dead from working too hard to keep in style. All they are really good for is their sperm and their money anyway.
Where I come from, women of my generation are too proud to have men pay for them; they decide what they want to do and are princesses in their own right – just that they won’t make themselves financially dependent.
I doubt your fear that 1/2 the seats would be empty if the requirement was 1 halakally Jewish grandchild for those 65 and over is well-founded. My Mother is 67. She is 4th generation Conservative Jew. She has 5 halakically Jewish grandchildren. 3 from me and 2 from my brother, a Conservative Jew who married a fully blooded Sephardic Conservative Jewess from Venezeula.
My little brother married a full-blooded reform Jewess. They have decided to have no children, they prefer their glamourous lifestyle and their dog. They have been happily married for 7 years. They may change their minds, they may not.
Again, I really think the propaganda about the “dying out” of Jewish families is highly exaggerated by those on the “right” to justify their extremism. And maybe those families that do “die out jewishly” weren’t “meant” to continue and maybe that “one survivor” will be Moshiach. Where is your faith JM?
All the ladies in Mom’s Hadassah chapter and Mah Jongg group have “halakically” Jewish grandchildren, although many also have intermarriage and conservative and reform conversions in their families. Again, we are going for strong family ties and happy, healthy well-adjusted, well-nourished and well-educated Jews…not just sheer numbers.
A “chosen” people whose job is to be “a light unto the nations” really should NOT try to compete with Arabs, rabbits or cockroaches when it comes to quantity.
P.S. Sarah…glad you enjoy waking up at 4:30 a.m., but that is not the life I want my Princesses to have to live. “Stingy” is never a good quality in a spouse.
Plenty of families have died out, Jewishly speaking. Or, are obviously on their way to it, although complete obliteration, Jewishly speaking, make take a few more years.
Or, maybe there will be one survivor. One kid, one kid, that my father bought for two zuzzim. One kid, one kid.
Sing it. You know the tune. We sing it at Passover.
OK
I’d invite my great-grandmother, but I’d need to find a loophole in jurisdiction to get a permit for an exhumation on account of a wedding.
The way to know was to give getting to know him time.
Marry the stingy redhead, (invite your silly Grandma), have a baby, and I will cede my title to you. You can be JM.
How did you know he had the right stuff?
Cool.
Next case.
Thanks, but I make my own money. Besides, I get up at 4:30 am every day to get everything ready before leaving the house. Works for me.
I understand your point, but also consider how much socially implied criteria can influence a person when looking for a spouse, often enough not giving actually decent matches even a fair chance. For instance, my great-grandmother used to tell me never to marry somebody who’s a redhead or stingy. My partner is both. When I first got to know him eight years ago, I found those two (actually minor important) traits of his to be appalling, but after a while the focus shifted on his many traits that I find to be absolutely endearing.
Money comes and goes. You marry a PERSON. All the money in the world belongs to G-d. If you want it, you can have some of it. We all know how to get thin, and we all know how to make money. We all make do with the figure, and the income, we have. We have to remember how to love. If we love, we will have enough of everything, because we will figure it out, and focus on what is important. The coffee will even be set up the night before because we will love enough to set it up the night before.
Sarah, see me in my office.
No, I didn’t mean take five minutes to decide if they are spouse material! I meant, don’t bother with people who are obviously not.
You are frightening me. Is everybody acceptable these days?
I meant, have a mentality that you have a goal and are not taking scenic detours.
Suppose five minutes suffice to check his account stats 😉
I meant, if you are pretty clear that this is just a fun time person, well, save your five dollars and your five minutes.
I guess I am against zapping hunger pains with candy bars, and I am against the social equivalent of that.
I am for solid nourishment. At least most of the time. I am JM. Yes, ice cream is a food. It has milk protein and milk fat, two solid foods. Too bad about the sugar.
Maybe your spouse should have the same nutrient profile as ice cream. Nourishing and also sweet.
Allan Pease has an interesting book about body language and Charles Sykes has one about other stuff. I have not read them yet.
You can really tell if someone is spouse material in under 5 minutes (and 5 dollars?) JM, you must have remarkably good instinctst he rest of us are sorely lacking!
If your parents furrow their brows, send them to me.
Worker bees…. worker bees…. mules….. comely, useful, intelligent, sterile: mules. Not surgically sterilized. Just socially sterilized. Spayed.
Terrible.
Demand your rights.
Do not spend five minutes or five dollars with someone who is not spouse material. Who are they to waste your time? Or you to waste theirs?
Use up some oxygen. Slam down big fat carbon footprint. Have children.
Like Jews? Make some.
Love, JM
If having one halachically Jewish grandchild were an entrance requirement for High Holiday synagogue attendance, for those aged 65 and up, would half the seats be empty?
Yes.
Maybe the freakim can address that. They carry on about everything else. Are they scared to touch this, the delicate little anarchists? Poor widdle dears.
Good job about the hair.
Ok… I’m sure the frum dentist and frum eye doctor agree with your sentiments that their services are not luxuries. Unfortunately, there are too many families that consider them to be so.
I agree that QUALITY is much more important than quantity. That is why most of the women in this neighborhood should have stopped breeding before the defects in their genetics manifested.
(No, Peter Yates was not a Jew and but he was some sort of fundamentalist something that believed in home schooling.)
Of course I feel a lot of compassion for people who are single or childless who DON’T want to be, but more adherance to strict religious dogma does not, in the least bit, help people out of those situations.
Cute joke, but seriously, the boys that aren’t bright enough to make a living should also stay out of hiding in Kollel because why would we want them as our future leaders?
I haven’t known any families that have “died out”? Do you? You worry too much about problems that are best left up to God to solve.
BTW, my hair is freakin’ FABULOUS!!!
I meant, pre-law. Old joke. A lawyer being a nice Jewish professional, a quality boy, in those days, who can’t stand the sight of blood. Ha ha.
Post 39 – I expressed myself badly. I meant that the eye doctor and the dentist are absolute necessities, on time, no matter what they cost, even if they are not covered by insurance.
Public school?
You are a bit Darwinian. That worked better before contraception, feminism and secularism. Then, the clever helped out the less so. Not now. The less so are no longer permitted to breed. They must be sterile workers, like in a bee hive.
What will become of the Jews who 1) can’t stand the sight of blood and who 2) can’t pass the pre-med exams either?
Does it matter?
It matters to me.
You are kind, but Jewlicious forever.
That was myself who suggested JM and Chutzpah start a blog. Within the city limits of my smallish Midwestern metropolis there are over 2300 people registered with Blogger and of those an estimated 2/3 have blogs up. And and overwhelming number of those are individuals allowing us into their won internal discussions. Most team blogs are sports blogs.
So I come to the Jewlicious comments section and read JM and Chutzpah’s repartee amongst those from other commenters. Chutzpah, your #33 comment is exactly why you two should blog (instead of just you and I wasn’t referring to the sex and lobster). You guys don’t even have to meet. There was a semi-successful band that recorded and put a video on You Tube and none of the member have ever met each other.
(Some people send their children to school as usual, but in addition they supplement their learning at home, using home schooling techniques. Obviously, this can be done well or badly.)
I acknowledge home schooling is a bit extreme but its techniques and viewpoint can be very useful. It can work sometimes. The spelling champ was home schooled.
If you are saying there is no hope for non-professionals, I will just be sad and give up. And, few male professionals can, or want to, support mama and baby. Be a woman ever so well paid, that doesn’t solve everything.
What happened to the right to be ordinary? Must we all be “quality”?
If the old suburban model of: good education, reasonably pleasant marriage, and two children, model, were still working, I would not say anything. It is not.
So I am trying to find an alternative to dying childless.
There are people who like the new way, and that is their right. But there are also people who do not.
I am sad to see families die out.
Maybe with your busy life you can’t feel what the childless feel, bless you.
Is he a Jew? And when did I excuse being crazy?
And re-reading your post JM, you sound like Peter Yates, who wonderful religion that promoted home schooling drove his wife to murder their five kids rather than think she was a sinning failure…keep it up with the religious pressure and you will see a lot more “sudden infant death syndrome” in the Ortho. circles than you already do. And no autopsies please…
OK … but not everybody comes from the strong background you describe. So he has done well again, has he? Married another woman from a strong background? Well well. But not everybody brings that off, either.
It was those people I was talking about.
People without any fairy godmothers around, just Hashem himself. That is most of us, I think.
Even the better-heeled can have problems without some kind of life-idea they think out, examine, take seriously, and don’t get arrogant about.
You can start out with money and, er, dribble, it away, quite easily. Yes, all of it. Especially this week.
What’s “a lot of money”? Depends what you do with it.
So I agree, brains are the ticket.
JM,
I am rebuilding my financial future and I assure you that I will buy a house for cash within the next 5 years for cash without help from my parents or a spouse. I will do it it with my brains, quality education and determination to provide for my children properly.
My ex also thinks the dentist and eye doctor are luxuries and I go crazy every six months getting the Court to force him to take the kids, which the Judge always does. This is America, children shouldn’t grow-up with bad teeth or ruin their eyes in 2007. There is free public school in this country where any child, in any school district can make something of themselves with the right direction.
The wearing all black in this down makes me want to puke. Teenagers should not walk around looking like Italian widows.
People have NO RIGHT to marry until they can pay for a wedding and NO RIGHT to produce until they can afford food, medical care and education for their off-spring, and that goes for any ethnic group.
Enough of this…I have to get to the Hair Salon.
You can’t get rich unless you use your brains properly, inherit it or hit the lottery.
One woman’s lazy, stupid MoFo is another woman’s Prince. I happen to come from a family of highly successful people and hung out with a crowd of Type-A overachievers in high school, college and law school. Anyone who was not earning 60,000 straight out of grad school in 1985 (remember the good ol’ “greed is good” Reagan ’80’s?) was considered lazy and stupid. If you weren’t an investment banker back then you might as well be flipping burgers.
My ex has been through two jobs since his remarriage last November and his lazy, stupid new wife thinks he’s a King. So good…I hope they are happy with their poverty mentality, their “God” (a.k.a. her parents) will provide faith and their Gemach hand-me down clothes, as long as they don’t pass those values down to my children.
This is not OT. We are discussing the fate of the beautiful young people in the photos above.
All that, above, is one hundred percent impossible without a spouse. Too depressing. The spouse is the comfort, when the deprivations hurt. Two spouses can encourage each other. As most consumption is about loneliness, the minute you are not lonely, you don’t need to consume. THAT IS WHY THE MONEY CULTURE MAKES SURE YOU, YES YOU, DO NOT MARRY. They need you single. So you will buy. Because you are lonely.
Fool them. You can do it your way. Don’t expect much support from the community, including your very own parents.
What failures? Sixty years without a world war? Widespread social advances? Environmental law? Vast access to information?
People who live tough, cheap, close, and focused buy a house for cash in five years. They know the traps and the angles. They stay home, socialize at home, cook, stay out of the dry-cleaners and do their own hair and nails. They wear a lot of black because everything matches that way. They eat an apple a day, sleep enough and don’t get sick. Their one luxury is frequent visits to the eye doctor and especially the dentist.
They have heard of home schooling, and they have a disciplined personal vision that both comforts, motivates and controls them, such as religion. They do not use much alcohol and nothing else. It smells bad and costs too much.
If you have a goal, you will meet it. If you want to have fun, then that is your goal. You will meet it. But you will not buy a house for cash in five years.
I didn’t buy a house for cash in five years. But other people have. I didn’t home school. But I used those techniques to great effect.
Really amusing overall. But let’s state that for most folks today, (in their 30’s), they are doing worse (economically) than their parents were doing at about the same age. There’s many reasons for this (being a lazy/stupid MoFo just one of many), and having plenty of debt from school is another issue that hangs over many young couples.
But money is a funny thing. People can follow it very closely. But being smart does not make you rich. (See the USA Today article: [http://www.usatoday.com/tech/science/columnist/vergano/2007-08-12-smart-not-rich_N.htm]). But being married usually means that your household income is higher. Reliably so. Even for the lazy/stupid MoFo’s. (And we all know why, right?)
So youth. Never quite what it once was, but somehow we’re always just a bit more envious than curious of their lot. Most start out poor or ‘modestly’. If they have some decent common sense & work hard & smart, they can do reasonably well. After years of hard work and shrewd planning. And lots of luck. It’s that last bit that’s always the trump card in the bunch.
Happily those bright eyes filled with so much promise know nothing or not too much of the ways of the world. If they did, they’d turn to the older generations and curse us for all our manifest failures we’ve left for them. Cheers, ‘VJ’
Giyoret,
Thanks. I had a blog but I caught a Troll from this site and had to shut it down. Now that CK and team seem to have been successful in eliminating said Troll, I might consider putting up a new blog. However, in the interim my life has gotten considerably less exciting and I don’t have much left to say. 37, newly divorced and size 3 beats 43, divorced 5 years and size m.y.o.b. when it comes to fresh blog material.
Chutzpah in a nutshell: she loathes self-imposed ghettos, abhors fanaticism of any type, and needs a steady playmate who likes Tom Jones music, sex and lobster, preferably all at the same time.
It is true.
Chutzpah:
The person who suggested that you two should write blogs was right…
You are also a really good writer and SO much fun to read~ I click on your comments right away.
“Over the rainbow”.. 🙂
I’m glad I can appreciate you both. It definitely adds to the whole conversion experience (did you even think you’d have that influence??)
Giyoret,
If you would like to keep good vocabulary and writing skills in your bloodline, may I strongly suggest that you do not send them to a Black Hat Yeshiva. They will learn “Yeshivish” there, a language whose butchering of English can be rivaled only by Ebonics.
I am starting my daughter ,who will be entering the 10th grade at a “moderate” Yeshiva, in a Princeton Review course this year so she can hold out some hope of competing with inner city minority children on the SAT’s.
Just another polite warning brought to you by someone whose been down the road ahead of you.
P.S. Jewish Mother hails from somewhere over the rainbow, way up high.
Not so fast, JM. 🙂
My grandfather was a journalist and also wrote 3 bestsellers in the 30’s; my mother got a degree in journalism but married and raised 6 children. Every one of us has a good vocabulary, and we joke that “it’s a genetic thing”, but it’s clear that it was something that was in our environment. (And there’s no doubt that part of why I was attracted to Judaism was smart thinkers who are good with words, and the discussion of important ideas.)
So what was your environment? You didn’t just pop out of nowhere……..
This whole thing is an unintentional epistolary novel, like the letters of Mme. de Sevigné.
But how to pull it together is for other people to figure out.
Thank you, Giyoret.
I am just a li’l ol’ poster, like everybody else.
JM- I am curious. Can you give us a bio? You write really well and have such a distinctive style. I know that some of what you write sets off sparks of disagreement, but you just keep on truckin’…I like people with strong opinions. A lot of people are bland, and work hard to stay that way, and it’s reassuring to read something solid and lively and interesting.
I have known women who thought an impractical intellectual was worth it, but they had to take him as he was, both fascinating and inspiring aspects, and limitations, and all. It is a matter of taste. There are downsides to everybody. An achiever may not be home much, and they are all sons of Adam. Men are different from other people. They cannot tell fuschia from puce and you have to live with that.
I agree. Some people are just not spouse material. One hopes most people are.
JM,You still didn’t admit that a good woman can’t and shouldn’t try to fix a poor man. How would you feel if one of your daughters brought one home? You’d probably piss on your kitty heels.
(That last was for GM, who thinks I am more obscure than Kant. He is probably right.)
No, I am, of course, not literally in favor of gangsterism. I am support the rule of law. Real-life gangsters should be in prison. Obviously. But you have to be careful what people may think. My crystal-clear prose is often misunderstood, for some reason.
No, I don’t believe in free lunches.
You are not a bitch. You are much nicer than I am. I would not have been one-millionth so nice as you were, to anybody, no matter how handsome. But I guess that is what seemed reasonable at the time.
And if it were my restaurant, there would be “minimum plus service” printed on the menu. This stuff is obvious. As for the other stuff, well, I was never anti-authority. I AM authority. I am JM. So are you. Gevura. Shape up. Chuck ’em in the river. Stuff like that. With apologies to the sharks for the poor material. With more of that, there would be less foolishness.
There used to be a Jewish Tough Guy, but he has been discontinued. Maybe we should bring him back. I think his name was Bernie the Crusher. He would be very convenient to have as a brother, when young and dewy. If memory serves, he was enormous, hairy and unsmiling. Maybe RICO did him in. Maybe it was too much Kumbaya singing.
We must forgive ourselves, nobody else will…
AND do’t try to say “yes, but she’s a nasty bitch with three children who will give her grandchildren…” because a turkey baster could’ve given me three children just as well and we’ve already had that discussion several thousand times.
“a good woman will fix the last”…that’s it JM you have pushed my atomic acid button this time.
A MAN WHO CAN’T RUB TWO NICKELS TOGETHER TO MAKE TEN CENTS CAN’T BE FIXED OR CHANGED!!!!!
“Ex, my grandmother will pay for you to go to pharmacy school.”
“Ex, would you like to learn to be an optician, my father will pay for your schooling.”
“Ex, go to Gemology school, your Boss (from the job I got you) will pay for your certification”
“Ex, here’s my $15,000 commission check that I earned this month, could you please invest it wisely and maybe get me some help in the house because I don’t feel like scrubbing toilets after handing oveer that kind of money to you…”
None of that helps…a lazy, stupid motherfucker can NOT be FIXED. You really give STUPID advice sometimes. My parents begged me not to try to fix a person.
Now, onto the “potentials” that are lurking around this sthetl. The ones that are so appealing that the Shidduch committee decided they will interview men from out of town but not women. The Plifton Ortho Single Men are smoking pot and taking e-pills, they are loitering in Acme and Barnes and Noble, they are latent homos who think that having a baby and a wife will prove that they are not gay, they are drop-outs from the secular economy that schnor a free shabbos meals and then pretend that their “tshuva” is so important they don’t have time to work.
People are not considerate and that is why, unfortunately, a restaurant like that should put a “per person minimum” on the bottom of the menu to keep the unsavory characters out. If they had to pay $18.00 per person to sit there and leave a 20% tip on that, you could be sure they’d be sitting on the bench of the peer instead. I hope the lobster vapors got in his hat and stunk it up.
Would anyone like to here about the frum women in charge of the public school headstart program (preschool for 2-5 year olds) who embezzled money from the program by charging her Victoria Secret’s purchases to the program’s supply budget because now I’m ready to spew up some more horror stories from the sthetl.
No , a poor shmuck CANT be fixed but he can turn a sweet, intelligent, beautiful, talented Jewish girl into a nasty bitch.
And people should be considerate and leave good tips.
Rabbi Yo can instruct us about whether Judaism does or does not say that women are holier than men. This does not make men bad puppies in any way.
Even if they are short, bald and poor. A good wife will fix the last, and the first two don’t matter. We cannot expect a man to be a great specimen if he is unmarried. Being unmarried is causing whatever is wrong with him. We look at married men and say, “I want one like that”. We forget he is “like that” exactly because of his wonderful wife! When he was unmarried, he, too, was mere potential, crying in its beer.
The can’t-win list:
1) If they want children, they are breeders and parasites. However, if they don’t want children, they are unnatural and unfeminine.
2) If they look great, they are high- maintenance princesses. If they don’t look great, they are slobs, and the other-nations women take better care of themselves.
3) If they complain, they are whiners. If they don’t complain, they are boring and complacent.
4) If they don’t want a man, they are walls designed to keep sea-water out of Holland. If they do want a man, they are clinging dishrags, who should stand on their own two feet.
I can do asperity too.
OK, I rephrase. What wonderful young women. What terrific business people they will make. They will be inspiring mothers and successful people in every way. They are obviously great catches and will have wonderful lives and lots of children. Their children will give them, and their lucky, if slightly less holy, through no fault of their own, husbands, much joy.
The stork method doesn’t work, and storks don’t have soulful eyes.
It is indeed hot. It’s T shirt time. I admire people who can do more. I try.
“Breeding stock” is a bit pungent for a way of life that brings new Jewlicious readers and posters. Surely you do not think Jews are found under cabbage leaves?
I am glad they are not. It is fun to be a Jewish mother. I would not trade it for any cabbage patch.
If there were a Nobel Prize for asperity, David would win it…. Keep it coming.
If there were a Nobel Prize for asperity, David would win it…. Keep it coming.
If there were a Nobel Prize for asperity, David would win it. Keep it coming.
Such eyes, such eyes, such holy, glowing eyes. What wonderful young women. What mothers they will make. . . . Judaism says women are holier than men, and you can just see it in these photos.
Needless to say, Judaism says nothing of the kind.
Nonetheless, it does remain quite ironic that those who tend to value Jewish women principally for their productivity as breeding stock tend to be the same ones who imbue them with the greatest degree of “holiness.†Kind of like the worshipful attitude of Hindus toward the Black Angus, who nonetheless are perfectly content to allow it to starve to death in the filthy alleys of Mumbai.
They look happy to be wearing tank tops in the heat!
Such eyes, such eyes, such holy, glowing eyes. What wonderful young women. What mothers they will make. They look like candles. The room is full of lights. You can read by those young women, they give off so much light.
The men are great too. But you know what I mean. Judaism says women are holier than men, and you can just see it in these photos. Just look at them. I am not talking about physical beauty.
My thing is ice cream.
please, my beautiful, young vibrant Jews, put away the cigars! Cancer is real, and we need as many smart people to stay alive as we can!
I’m starting to sound like Jewish Mother…
Gila – my eyesight may have been affected by the wine. Sincerest apologies. How was your eyesight that evening?
Dude…I was there…with Ahuvah…you clearly have bad eyesight!
I was at the Beer festival, which took place on the same day (and on Thursday) in the Mitcham Harakevet (located near the old train station by Derech Chevron and Rechov Remez. I live close enough to there to walk home.
There were several live music acts each evening, including MissFlag on Thursday.
Oh yeah. You introduced me to nico. He’s French right?
i am famous!! woo hoo- and the some guy is nico…